Conversation No. 61-1

Date:  June 14, 1971
Time:  Unknown between 8:30 am and 4:34 pm
Location:  Cabinet Room

William P. Rogers met with John N. Irwin, II, U. Alexis Johnson, Nathanial Samuels, William B. Macomber, Jr., Richard F. Pedersen, William I. Cargo, Marshall Green, Rodger P. Davies, Martin J. Hillenbrand, Martin F. Herz, Charles A. Meyer, Harvey R. Wellman, Maurice J. Williams, David M. Abshire, John N. Mitchell, Elliot L. Richardson, John B. Connally, Roger T. Kelley, Leonard Unger, Robert H. McBride, Arthur K. Watson, Kingdon Gould, Jr., William J. Handley, Ellsworth F. Bunker, George H. W. Bush, John D. Ehrlichman, General Alexander M. Haig, Jr., Ronald L. Ziegler, Donald H. Rumsfeld, Egil (ABud@) Krogh, Jr., John E. (AJack@) Ingersoll, and Richard M. Helms

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

The President entered at 10:07 am

	Attendance
		-Relation to importance of meeting

	Drug problem
		-Attack on supply source
		-Prosecution of pushers
		-Treatment of users
		-Education
		-Scope
		-Use of drugs by overseas personnel
			-Relation to larger problem
		-Focus of current meeting
		-Location of heroin production
			-Attack on supply
			-Role of administration officers

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	Foreign policy implications

[To listen to the segment (23s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-529.]

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		-Announcement of programs
		-Krogh=s presentation
			-Overview of problem
				-Ingersoll=s role

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	Southeast Asia

[To listen to the segment (14s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-529.]

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		-Ingersoll=s presentation
			-Overview of problem
				-Number of addicts in United States
					-Nature of addiction
					-Age breakdown
						-Trends
					-Deaths in New York City
						-Age breakdown
					-Trends in domestic use
						-Urban versus suburban

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BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 3
[National Security]
[Duration:  8m 14s  ]

	SOUTHEAST ASIA

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 3

[To listen to the segment (1h2m20s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-529, E-530.]

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				-Consumer education
					-Effect of marijuana
						-Entrance into drug culture
				-Growth of drug use
					-Class involvement
						-Upper class versus ghettos

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	Southeast Asia

[To listen to the segment (10m44s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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		-New initiatives
			-Narcotics office
				-Organizational location
				-Consolidation of authority
				-Effect of new agency
					-Evaluation of methods
				-Goals
				-Money for rehabilitation
				-Prosecution of corrupt officials
					-Need for expanded powers
					-Background
					-Basis for law
					-Ongoing federal investigations
					-Proving of intent
				-Department of Defense efforts
					-Kelley
					-Goals
					-Veterans Administration programs
					-Civilian programs
					-Military programs
					-Linkage of discharge and treatment
			-International efforts
				-Congressional role
				-United Nations fund
					-United States= role

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	Germany

[To listen to the segment (6s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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			-Identification of addicts
			-Beliefs about addiction
			-Power of Southeast Asian heroin compared to United States= heroin

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	Drugs in Europe

[To listen to the segment (2m4s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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		-Thanks to ambassadors
		-Priority of efforts
			-Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI] and Attorney General role
		-Magnitude of problem
			-Drugs as Apublic enemy number one@
		-Necessity of effective action
		-Use of drugs as seen by psychiatrists
		-Effect of drugs on past civilizations
		-Countermeasures of other countries

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	Japan

[To listen to the segment (13s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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		-Effect in United States
			-Relation to crime
			-Responsibility of administration
		-Diplomatic priorities
		-Need for resources
		-Publication of the President=s attitudes on drug abuse
			-Diplomatic drawbacks versus need for action

The President left at 11:54 am

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

Recording was cut off at an unknown time before 4:34 pm

Conversation No. 61-2

Date:  June 14, 1971
Time:  Unknown between 11:54 am and 11:59 pm
Location:  Cabinet Room

Frank T. Gladney met with John J. McNamara, C. J. Coughlin, William W. Winpisinger, Charles J. Chamberlain, Anthony L. Krause, C. L. Dennis, J. R. Tipton, A. T. Otto, Jr., Charles R. Pfenning, J. W. O=Brien, Richard W. Smith, James E. Yost, Charles E. Goodlin, Harold C. Crotty, Charles Luna, John A. Volpe, Charles W. Colson, George T. Bell, and Willie J. Usery, Jr.

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

The President and James D. Hodgson entered at 4:34 pm

	Introduction of railway union leaders

	Photo opportunities

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

	Attendance at meeting

	Reasons for meeting
		-Focus on national problems
		-Meeting with railroad executives
			-Railroad future
				-Importance of railroad to economy
			-Industry problems
				-New capital
				-Regulatory reforms
			-Monopolistic trends
				-Trucking
				-Airlines
		-Work with railroad industry
		-Interstate Commerce Commission [ICC]
		-Industry problems
			-Taxation
				-Effect on jobs
				-Effect on railroad competition
			-Reinvestment of profits
				-Effect
			-Responsibility for problems
			-Railroad stock
				-Public perception
		-Advantages of railroad industry
		-Need for constructive ideas
		-Problems as pointed out by railroad executives

	Labor perspective on railroad problems
		-Decline of industry
			-Composition of work force
		-Effectiveness of regulation
			-History of regulation
			-Trucking industry
		-Industry problems
			-Government interest in labor-management stability
				-Usery=s role
				-Grievance procedures
				-Bargaining changes
				-Open contracts
				-Contract negotiating
				-Focus on fundamentals
					-Bargaining trends
					-Progress in industry
			-Operations
				-Railroad=s role in trade
					-Compared with 1950s
				-Railroad=s competitive position
			-Industry future
				-National Railroad Passenger Corporation/American Track [AMTRAK] negotiations
					-Report of joint railroad/union meeting
						-Illinois Central
				-Need for changes in railroad operations
					-Obstacles
						-Freight loss
				-Industry task forces
					-Finance
					-Yard operations
				-Prosperity of railroad
					-Role of workers
				-Prospects for railroad prosperity
				-Owners of railroads
					-Other interests
				-Joint report
					-Content
					-Benefits
				-Report from unions
			-Railroad presidents= committee=s relation to union presidents= committee
				-Negotiating committee
					-Background
					-Responsibility
					-Union responsibility
				-Need for railroad presidents= participation
				-Strikes
					-Recent
					-Forthcoming
					-Necessity
					-Avoidance
						-Exchange of information
				-Need for railroad presidents= active participation
				-Louis Menk
				-Jack Fishwick
				-William Johnson
				-Edd Hamilton Bailey
				-Benjamin F. Biaggini
				-Graham Claytor
				-Jack Hill
				-Menk=s part in negotiations
				-Fishwick
				-Hill=s responsibility
				-Railroad presidents
				-Bill Luxy [?]
					-Effect on unions
						-Timing on negotiations
			-Regulation of railroads compared to regulation of other industries
				-Airlines
				-Shipping
				-Trucking
			-Railroad=s concern of legislation
			-Benefits of contact between union leaders and railroad presidents
			-Experience of union leaders
				-Management
			-The President=s schedule
			-Regulatory situation
				-Standards of operations
					-Central New Jersey Railroad
					-Maintenance shortcomings
						-Effect
				-Computerization
				-Safety of track
					-Maintenance needs
				-Rail safety legislation
				-Safety
					-Union role
					-Role of adequate oversight
					-Letter file
					-Management role
					-Need for discussion by top level executives
					-Dennis
					-Luna
			-Maintenance situation
				-Effort to free railroad money for maintenance
			-Competition for railroad
				-Aid to railroad competitions
			-Railroad taxes
				-Inequities
			-Freight
				-Percentage of non-compensatory freight
				-Charges
					-Management
				-Volume
					-Prospects
						-Need for growth
				-Containers
					-Benefits
					-New efforts
				-Investment in railroads
			-Regulation situation
				-Role of ICC
				-Investment by railroads in other ventures
				-Recently concluded negotiations
				-Reduction in outside investment
					-The President=s family background
					-Early goals

	Presentation of gifts by the President
		-Cuff links
		-Pins for wives
		-Reelection and salary increase for unknown labor leader

	Administration=s role in railroad industry
		-Volpe
		-Hodgson
		-Usery

The President left at 5:29 pm

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

Gladney, et al. left at an unknown time before 11:59 pm

Conversation No. 61-4

Date:  June 15, 1971
Time:  Unknown between 7:55 am and 11:59 pm
Location:  Cabinet Room

Hugh Scott met with Norris Cotton, Peter H. Dominick, Milton R. Young, Gerald R. Ford, Leslie C. Arends, John B. Anderson, Barber B. Conable, Jr., Richard H. Poff, Robert C. (ABob@) Wilson, John J. Rhodes, Robert T. Stafford, H. Allen Smith, Frank T. Bow, Robert J. Dole, Egil (ABud@) Krogh, Jr., Henry A. Kissinger, John D. Ehrlichman, George P. Shultz, Clark MacGregor, Herbert G. Klein, William E. Timmons, Harry S. Dent, Kenneth E. BeLieu, Richard K. Cook, Patrick J. Buchanan, and Ronald L. Ziegler

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

The President entered at 8:02 am

	Schedule of meeting
		-Ford=s commitments

	Drug problem
		-Priority
		-Forthcoming programs
			-Background
				-Treasury role
			-Outline
				-Four parts
				-President=s press conference
				-Originators
				-Enforcement
					-Controlled Dangerous Substances Act
				-Rehabilitation
				-Education
				-Interdiction of supply

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	World provisions

[To listen to the segment (59s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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				-Enforcement
					-Controlled Dangerous Substances Act
						-Content
				-Treatment and education
					-Focus
				-Perception of problem
				-Creation of executive office
				-Other programs
				-Need for national strategy
					-Location of new office
					-Organizational set-up
					-Responsibilities
						-Organization
						-Accountability
				-Evaluation of programs
					-New office role
				-Washington, DC example
					-Results
				-Rehabilitation
					-Focus on problem
					-Flexibility of programs
				-Organization of new office
					-Evaluation of performance
				-Goals of treatment
					-DC program
					-Employment
					-Crime reduction
				-Organization of new agency
					-National Aeronautics and Space Administration [NASA] role as an example
				-Money spent on drug programs
					-Location
					-Lyndon B. Johnson=s budget
					-New proposals
				-Dispersal of new money
					-Veterans= Administration [VA]
					-Treatment programs
						-State versus local
					-Bureau of Narcotics and Dangerous Drugs [BNDD]
					-Bureau of Customs
						-Use
					-Overseas operations

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	Europe

[To listen to the segment (30s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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					-Inspection of domestic producers
				-Breakdown of budgeted money
					-Research
						-Role of new agency
						-Methadone substitution efforts
						-Methadone treatment details
			-Details of programs
				-Legislative impact
				-Community-level efforts
					-Organization
						-Response
						-Phoenix role
				-Spending details
					-Organization
					-Implementation
						-New agency=s role
				-Detection of addiction
					-Military efforts
			-Department of Defense [DOD] programs
				-Provisions
				-Identification of users
					-Urine analysis
				-Detoxification
					-Location
					-Counseling
				-Additional treatment
				-Later treatment
					-Options
				-Addiction to other drugs
					-Focus on heroin
					-Language of enabling legislation
				-John G. Kester
				-Effectiveness in Vietnam compared to United States
				-Ellsworth F. Bunker
				-General Creighton W. Abrams, Jr.
				-European problem
				-Donald H. Rumsfeld
				-Military in Europe versus tourists
				-Obligation of United States
				-Opportunity for solving problem
				-Extent of United States= obligation
				-Urine analysis
					-Timing and location of tests
					-Details of test
				-Military problems
					-Exposure to drug culture
					-Handling of identified users
						-Vietnam
						-United States
					-Post-discharge aid
				-Marijuana use
				-Focus on non-dangerous drugs
				-Claims of disability
					-VA=s role
					-Legalisms
				-Marijuana use
					-Exposure to drug culture
					-Need for conformity within administration
					-Research
						-New York doctors
			-Announcement
				-Timing
				-Military aspects
				-Diplomatic aspect
			-Legislative details
				-Appropriations
					-Supplemental
			-Customs personnel increase
				-Breakdown
				-Inspection procedures
					-Complaints

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	Europe and Southeast Asia

[To listen to the segment (1m22s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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				-United States= efforts to stop supply
					-Alternative sources
					-Role of demand
			-Prosecution of pushers
				-Progress to this point
				-Success versus failure
					-Statistics
			-Debate within government and within nation
				-Need for firm administration position
			-Treatment of addicts
			-Education
				-Need for attitude change
				-Demographics of addiction
					-Ghetto compared to suburban drug use
					-High school compared to college drug use
				-Attitude towards drug use
				-Need for public education
				-Prospects for success

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	Japan

[To listen to the segment (31s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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			-Prosecution of pushers
				-Reward for information regarding pushers
					-Bounty versus private fund
						-Detroit News program
				-Court situation
					-New York situation
					-Use of special narcotics courts
				-Publicity of successful prosecution
				-Prosecution of police accepting bribes
			-Money required to support a habit
				-Death statistics
					-New York City
			-Benefits of clear administration stance
			-Evidence on marijuana addiction
			-Need for clear line drawn by administration
				-National Institute of Mental Health [NIMH]
				-Perception by public
				-Philadelphia program
				-Use of probation
				-Conflicting nature of evidence regarding addiction
			-Funding of programs
				-Supplemental appropriations
					-DOD money
				-Elliot L. Richardson
				-John N. Mitchell
				-Agency competition
			-Reaction of ambassadors
				-Concerns regarding their countries
				-Priority of drug offensive
					-Congress
				-Consumer/supplier relationships
			-Public support for programs
			-Scope of problem
			-Government responsibilities
			-Military programs
			-Television speech by the President
				-Identification of drug problem
				-The President=s American Medical Association [AMA] speech
					-Role of doctors in drug control

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	Southeast Asia

[To listen to the segment (2m9s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-530.]

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	Anti-War amendments
		-McGovern-Hatfield
		-Congressional support
			-Voting breakdown
		-Wording compared to legal impact
			-Senate goals
			-John C. Stennis
			-Robert N. C. Nix [?]
		-McGovern-Hatfield
			-Vietnam veterans against the war
				-Tactics
				-Views
					-Coalition government

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	Southeast Asia

[To listen to the segment (10m33s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-531.]

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		-The President=s religion
			-Congressional Record remarks
		-Conversation among Ford, Arends, and Carl B. Albert
			-Withdrawal resolutions
				-Nedzi-Whelan amendment
		-Sympathy for congressional plight
		-The President=s responsibilities

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	Southeast Asia

[To listen to the segment (21m52s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-531.]

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				-Pentagon papers
					-Origin
					-Content
					-Effect of breach of security
					-Publication of material
				-History of the President=s Vietnam policy
				-Critics of the President
					-Cyrus R. Vance
					-Clark M. Clifford
						-Role in previous policies
				-Johnson=s role in war
					-Contingency plans
					-Barry M. Goldwater
				-Effect on country of doubts regarding leadership

The President left at 9:48 am

	[General conversation/Unintelligible]

Recording was cut off at an unknown time before 11:59 pm